Red Alert Checklist

[Phenyx]

How many times have you been asked how to spot a pretender or predator? Are there specific signs to watch for? Will it show in their actions? The words they use? Will it be how they present themselves? Will it show in their attitude? And the list goes on...
I understand that common sense is pretty much the key to this line of worry, but for me? It does help a little to find more confidence in this very slow walk through self discovery that is on a path lined with doubts, insecurities, and worries to have a few extra pieces of knowledge hidden in my back pocket to hold onto when niavity shows her big beautiful smile in the uncertain and first time attempt at negotiations.
So maybe asking for suggestions is the wrong approach? Perhaps instead we should start a check list? Here, I will start:

(1) during introductions you are told names do not matter
(2) after asking second question being told to shut your mouth and listen as that is the place of the student
(3) while trying to negotiate time being told to figure it out and time is non negotiable
(4) while trying to bring up limits being told that you are too inexperienced to know what a limit is and that he will set them himself
(5) while trying to set boundaries being told it is his right as Trainer to decide what is good for me
(6) while questioning experiance being told that he has enough to know exactly what I need and to stop asking childish questions as they are a waste of time
(7) after listening to what is to be expect being told that training is not for sexual gratification, as he is not my Dom and as Trainer it is not his place to offer rewards in the form of his cock, my orgasms now belong to him as first lesson is in self control and for his time? I would suck his cock dry at the end of every session.
(8) after hearing enough? You get up to leave and he grabs your wrist and commands you to 'Sit. Down. Now'

Now understand that is my first attempt at real life negotiation, so maybe it is wrong for me to think that this trainer is an over inflated power hungry dick, maybe it is not.
If I am misunderstood? Please feel free to set me straight.
I would like to send a huge THANK YOU to all of those here that have given their time to put up with my chatty insecure doubt filled naive newby butt because without you and your wisdom? I may not seen the red flags in this negotiation. So again? Thank you.
And to those of you that too have experienced something similar to this? Feel free to add to the check list.

[Boha]

Some people are still not aware of the need of 3 really important things to remember before playing in bdsm:
communication
conversation
talk

Then you can play.

beware of persons who call themselves a Dominant and says what you mentioned. Their problem is often lack of self esteem, compensated by a loud voice

[PurpleKnight]

Phenyx,

You've started multiple threads on this same issue. You've discussed it with me (and others, I am assuming) in private.

My question is this. If our advice is so valuable, why are you still dwelling on it? I made it perfectly clear already that this person in question is NOT safe, NOT a true Dominant and someone to move on from. I fail to understand what other responses you are hoping to find here. Boha's response right above mine here is dead on. The thing is... you've heard similar responses repeatedly and only opened up new threads.

Avoid that guy. He isn't safe. Look for a Dominant that communicates, respects boundaries and is interested in understanding what you are hoping to get out of the relationship.

[Phenyx]

It appears i have offended you once again.
First: if you are referring to the question about What a Trainer is? Then yes, i am absolutely guilty of being confused as i am new at this and still learning and was trying to figure out the dynamics of what a Trainer actually is. that question had nothing to do with this checklist and everything to do with trying to find enough understanding so i know what the hell i am to be looking for in the first place.

Second: You should not question the value of your, or anyone else's, advice. it is because of that advice that i had enough smarts to realize a red flag when i seen one. and for that? I will Thank You again for your kind words and wisdom.

Third: I am not dwelling on it, as a matter of fact? I have more then moved on from that rediculous mess however? If i may be so bold to point out the fact that I am NOT the only newby that is joining this forum, nor am i not the only one that has these very same concerns. and i did not start this thread to gain sympathy nor get a pat on the back from others, i started it because when one is already questioning their place with no understanding of how this is suppose to work for them be it ol or rl, then perhaps in this very real area of concern they can take my story and see through your response that this is not good behavior, this is not typical, and it is not safe.
And yes, you DID make it perfectly clear that this situation was not safe and that this man was not a true Dominant, and you know what? You will now have told every damn newby that reads this thread. So again? Thank you for your response.
And lastly: If I may once again be so bold to point out the name of the thread? Red Alert Checklist, the key word here being 'Checklist' though i truly do value your opinion and i am very grateful that you have point out the wrongness of this situation, the purpose of this thread is to open the eyes of the niave and give a place where others that may have found themselves in similar situation to add to the 'Checklists' of what is right and wrong when you are up against a pretender and/or predator.
I come to this forum looking for answers, knowledge and understanding and as very sad as this is to admit? before i came to this forum and spoke to the many wonderful people here willing to help a naive beginner out? I would have thought that lovely situation was ok, maybe a little intense and yes it would have ticked me off but still? i would have thought it to be ok, and you know what else? I didn't even realize that 'Pretenders' were a thing until i came to this forum, so again? Thank you for your kind words of wisdom, both to me and to this thread as they truly did help in understanding that just because someone boasts? Does not make it true.
So again, i do sincerely apologize for offending you but i do not apologize for putting up this thread.

[PurpleKnight]

I'm not in the least offended, Phenyx. I feel that there is an unneeded rehashing of the same information and themes, however.

You don't need a checklist to raise a red flag when searching for a Dominant. The signs are very clear. One- lack of communication. Two- lack of respect over boundaries. Three- safety isn't a priority. Four- your needs and opinions are not valued.

My point is that everyone keeps telling you these things and we keep coming back at it from a different angle. You are over complicating things.

I appreciate that you are wanting to learn. What prompted my response, however, I am perplexed when you ask me or others for advice in private, are given an answer and proceed to come here and ask the same questions only to receive the same responses from others. I can drudge up about half a dozen threads where people have said the same things said in this one. Communication. Respect. Safety. If someone is telling you that you don't have the right to set limits? Lack of respect. Grabbing you when you get up to leave? Lack of safety. If you are in public, make a scene and then leave, not to contact the person again.

Edit: This information is also readily available throughout this entire forum. It has been repeated like a mantra, especially in pinned threads. The admins and mods here constantly stress that play should be safe and consensual, that communication needs to be a foundation for D/s or M/s relationships and that beyond that, the possibilities are only limited by your personal boundaries- which need to be respected.

[The Jaded Dominant { koral }]

As has been mentioned this is a subject well covered on the site

http://www.bdsmlibrary.com/forums/bd...tml?highlight=

this covers just about everything

J D

[dom1964]

Phenyx I am so proud of you for putting this out there as a Dom i tell many Doms that i teach the only way to a slaves
heart is trust and honesty you just hit on both I have been doing this for 35yrs and i can tell you i wouldnt have the
great people i do if i had lied or hurt anyone of them you have to have communcation at all times and you have to
both agree on what goes or dosent never should a dom ever ever be a bully yes control is a part of our lifestyle
but the said slave or bottom should have at least an option you have to remember slaves ,submissives,and bottoms
are not exspendable not alot of people want to do this so to all you Doms out there who want to be a dick go
ahead and see how long you last and if you dont listen to anything i say listen to this and remember ,if your
trainee is hurt or damaged in any way ask yourself how long are they going to stick around besides isnt this
lifestyle meant to have fun for both involved so if you ruin the trust and the fun then why would they want to be
with you anymore.

[Phenyx]

thank you all for your responses, I will cherish every word of wisdom you have to offer.

Jaded Dominant? Thank you for that link, i honestly did not see that one and hope that it is ok that i copy, pasted and printed it off.

PurpleKnight? You are right, repetition is a nothing more then banging your head against the wall. And again, you are right, i do ask questions from many different angles but i do this not to complicate things but to gain a response from someone that can take control in a 'good' way, I do this because i am making a list and i am making that list not to have something to check off but to remind me that everything is going to be ok, because it is not ok. and i do not ask hundreds of people the same question instead i may ask hundreds of questions to those few that have offered to give their advice and right now? i am counting on those answers, i need those answers because knowledge is power and i am so tired of being afraid. So i will add your responses to my list and again i sincerely thank you for your advice, opinion, and response. No matter how grumpy it may come? it is still honest and that is all that really matters.

and on a personal note: I'm still not sorry i started this thread.

[LaMarrKee]

That wasn't a 'negotiation', lass, as you describe it- it was an attempt to seize control from you, and institute a regime of abuse. No more, no less. Glad you had sense enough to run.